Cannot send out same MIDI note on same MIDI channel/port externally

Bug Description

I found a way that i love using synth as a midi controller with an external synth! Instead of using the full layout grid. Turn all 3 grids to your jack# / midi channel, and turn each grid into a different octave as well. Like blue C2, yellow C3, and purple C4, and now you also have the option of having 3 sequencers / arps with your external synth.

This can also be implied to using the same preset / sound on each grid and then you can have each grid at different octaves and have 3 sequencers / arps per preset!

ok however there is a slight down fall to doing it this way… Any note you latch on one grid, and if you find that same note in the same octave on another grid, it cancels it out and makes the latched note stop… It shouldn’t be unlatching the latched note!

However if you’re using sequencer / arp then it works fine without doing that!

So i went and put the same internal preset on all 3 grids, blue on C2 octave, yellow on C3 octave, purple on C4 octave… And latched a blue note, and found that same note over on yellow grid and it did NOT stop it from playing, but it does when using midi with external synth. So works for internal synths, but not for external synths it seems…

Steps to Reproduce

Written above in the best way that i can describe it

Occurrence / Frequency

Every time!

Found in Firmware

1.0.1
Build 1459

Attachments

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Photos, short videos, project folder (.zip only).

I have a few questions:

Just to be sure I understand it: You can play the same note from each internal synth on top of itself, but not on external gear via MIDI?

What are the MIDI out channels set to for each of the synth slots?

Correct! It doesn’t seem to mmatter which midi out it is, as long as all 3 grids use the same midi out / jack#. I have tested this with my kodamo essencefm on jack#4 and my novation nova desktop on jack#5 and can reproduce it each time. However it works for internal synths, just not external.

So you are using the same MIDI channel on all 3 grids, and want them all to play the same note at the same time on the same external device?

Are you able to do this with any other gear? Can your DAW in combination with the same external synths play the same note 3 times on top of each other?

I’m asking because I think it might not be a limitation in Synth, but a general limitation with either MIDI and/or the external gear. It could also be a limitation in Synth’s MIDI implementation, though.

I am not sure about the DAW thing as I don’t do things like that with them etc.

However I do believe my novation launchpad pro mk3 works fine this way if i remember correctly.

Also why would this work fine with internal synths but not external synths, that is the confusing part which makes me think it’s a bug?

I really hope I understand your situation correct. Let me try to explain:

With the internal synths, you are playing 3 different synths/instruments. With all grids set to output to the same MIDI channel you are trying to play 3 things on a single synth/instrument.

Try seeing it as 3 persons playing a good old piano with one finger each. You can play a chord together if you press one key each in that chord. And you can also play C2, C3 and C4 simultaneously. But if you all try to press the key of C3 at the same time, only one note will be played, because somebody else is already holding down that key, when person 2 and 3 hit the key. I believe it’s the same thing happening here: You already “pressed down that key” in the external synth, so you won’t be able to play it on top of itself.

While with the internal synths, even if they are using the same preset, you can play them on top of each other, as they act as 3 “separate pianos”.

If you set the MIDI channel for blue to control your Kodamo Essencefm on jack#4 and the MIDI channel for yellow to control you Novation Nova Desktop on jack#5, I bet you will be able to play the same note externally on blue and yellow on top of each other, because now you are playing on “2 different pianos”.

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If you set the MIDI channel for blue to control your Kodamo Essencefm on jack#4 and the MIDI channel for yellow to control you Novation Nova Desktop on jack#5, I bet you will be able to play the same note externally on blue and yellow on top of each other, because now you are playing on “2 different pianos”.

I will try this in a bit and report back :]

Ok I think you may be right, although I swear my novation launchpad pro mk3 acts differently.

I did put kodamo essencefm on jack#4 and novation nova on jack#5 and found the same notes on both grids and they played fine, however when both midi are on the same jack# it cancels them out. However works for internal synths using the same sound but different grids.

Makes me wonder if my novation launchpad did do that or I am mistaken, either way the write up you describe still makes sense.

So… At this point: Do you still think this is a bug?

To be honest, still not sure lol but probably not and just midi limitation!

You mentioned you believe you can get different results with your Launchpad. Did you try this?

I will see if i can have time to do that again today or this weekend :]

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Any news here?

Hi all @here , following your discussion above, my conclusion is that it’s just how MIDI works: you cannot play two same notes on same MIDI channel at the same time. On a real instrument it’s physically impossible :wink: I’ll close this by design.

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