Allow recording changes to Master FX

[Ohsomacho]

What is the problem?

It isn’t possible to record changes to Master FX in a project. The values for Reverb send, Delay send, etc, can be tweaked and recorded at the step level, but not the type of reverb, delay, etc.

What do you want to achieve?

Record changes in the types of various Master FX (Reverb, Delay, Sound, Limiter, and saturation). Ideally, this could be done at the step level, allowing to select the type of reverb, delay… in addition to its send values.

This way, users could record the effect types that are available in Perform mode and the possibility to change them quickly that Perform mode offers.

Given that only one type of Master FX (i.e. one type of reverb) can run at a time, the effect type recorded would be the last one defined in a step, which would affect the entire pattern. This would mirror the Perform Mode behavior, where only one effect type is applied at a given time.

Are there any workarounds?

No.

Any links to related discussions?

No.

Any references to other products?

This is possible on Akai MPC range, Elektron devices (a click thru to a sub menu)

[icaria36]

Delay and Reverb can be changed in Pattern Mode changing the Master FX. Do you mean that users should be able to assign different types of reverb and delay to each pattern?

[Ohsomacho]

Users should be able to…

a) have different reverb / delay for each TRACK within a pattern (having diff reverb / delay per STEP would be crazy and probably unworkable)

b) diff types of reverb and delay and for each pattern - imagine your song gets to a really epic chorus and you change a small room reverb to a big, lush cavern reverb!

c) be able to change a limited number of parameters for each effect type and record automation for them - eg: start of a track has a short delay, then you sweep it to a long delay time or increase the stereo width etc

I appreciate the fx on the Play are very good but they’re not meant to replicate a Valhalla VST!

[icaria36]

@Ohsomacho

have different reverb / delay for each TRACK

This would allow different types of reverb or delay running simultaneously, in different tracks. I wonder whether there is a technical limitation to achieve this (no idea, it would be useful to know).

@Ohsomacho

(having diff reverb / delay per STEP would be crazy and probably unworkable)

Maybe this is in fact simpler than having different types of effects simultaneously, as long as there is only one type of effect at a time. Performer Mode already shows that different types of delay and reverb can be applied as fast as your fingers can go, but only one type at a time.

UI-wise, setting or changing parameters at the step level is already supported. Users can already change reverb and delay parameters at the step level. Maybe “just” adding the possibility to change the effect type at the step level as well would achieve what you are looking for?

If it isn’t technically possible to have multiple types of effects at the same time, then one way to implement this would be to use a specific type of delay/reverb until a new one is applied at any step in a sequence. Then all reverb/delay in subsequent steps would use the new type.

This could have interesting side effects, because you could have specific delay/reverb parameters in a specific steps that would be run through different types of delay/reverb when they are changed by other steps.

[Piotr]

One “master” reverb and one “master” delay is the limitation of the system. We can’t achieve different settings for each track.

There is an update coming that allows user to pick custom preset values (for reverb, delay, sound, limiter). But this is another story. More info soon.

[icaria36]

Thank you @Piotr, this information is useful!

@Ohsomacho, re-reading the description of your request, and with what we have learned, should we focus then on the possibility to define different types of Master FX (reverb, delay, and the rest) at the step level? We could propose that the Master FX would be always the last defined in any step, affecting the entire pattern

There would be a corner case when the user defines two different effect types on the same step in different tracks. There could be a solution like choosing always the higher number track, or something.

Tweaking effects and recording automation is already possible. No need to add this in the request, unless you mean something different?

[Ohsomacho]

Hey

My core request was the ability to change the reverb and delay type at the master level + tweak some key parameters (delay time, etc)

My additional request was to see if it could be done at a track level, but as @Piotr explained thats not possible and thats cool

Being able to change the master fx at the step level would be very cool - would add some really interesting movement to songs

Thanks for clarifying the automation - I forgot.

[icaria36]

Ok. Given that Master FX can be changed on the fly while playing (it takes so steps, but it can be done), I believe the really missing feature in your request is the possibility to record these changes and store them in the project data.

Also, Reverb and Delay are two of the five Master FX available (there is also Sound, Limiter, and Saturation), and I bet implementing the same improvements for the other effects is basically the same work, therefore I would make the request about Master FX instead of reverb and delay only.

Based on all this, I propose these changes:

Allow recording changes to Master FX

What is the problem?

It isn’t possible to record changes to Master FX in a project. The values for Reverb, Delay, etc, can be tweaked and recorded at the step level, but not the type of reverb, delay, etc.

What do you want to achieve?

Record changes in the types of various Master FX (Reverb, Delay, Sound, Limiter, and saturation). Ideally, this could be done at the step level, allowing to select the type of reverb, delay… in addition to its values.

This way, users could record the effect types that are available in Perform mode and the possibility to change them quickly that Perform mode offers.

Given that only one type of Master FX (i.e. one type of reverb) can run at a time, the effect type recorded would be the last one defined in a step, which would affect the entire pattern. This would mirror the Perform Mode behavior, where only one effect type is applied at a given time.

[Piotr]

You might want to add “Send” to values (…The values for Reverb Send, Delay Send, etc…)

Other than that, looks like a legit wish to me

[icaria36]

Thank you @Ohsomacho for your and thank you @Piotr for your suggestion and for confirming that this request is sensible.

[miropoly]

@icaria36 @Ohsomacho Unfortunately after discussing with the development team internally, this feature needs extending the number of step parameters and we cannot do it at this point due to technical limitations. I’m afraid we have to decline the wish. Thanks for your contribution.